debate

Can you tell me which lists that? Here's another metaanalists that says otherwise, though. I just can't believe that even with a diet devoid of cholesterol you can have high cholesterol levels thanks to lack of exercise. I'd need some kind of proof backing that up. https://www.pcrm.org/good-nutrition/nutrition-information/lowering-cholesterol-with-a-plant-based-diet Cholesterol is not completely hazardous when managed, but it is easier to have high cholesterol as a carnist than as a vegan. You haven't given a thing that meat has that would arrent the risk. You can supplement iron easily.

"You do know that the B12 in meat isn't naturally occurring, its artificially fortified right? (You can thank factory farming and soil erosion on that) Aka a supplement? And that omnivores also suffer with B12 deficiencies? The micronutrients you get aren't necessary to be healthy as well. And vegans are perfectly higher with a low fat high carb diet, unless you can prove otherwise?" B12 is naturally occuring in meat, infact it is the plant products that are fortified to have B12 in them. Now, I am not sure if meat products get fortified to make them richer in B12, but that kinda seems unnecessary, cause they already have high B12. https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/VitaminB12-HealthProfessional/#:~:text=of%20Vitamin%20B12-,Food,5%2C13%2D15%5D.

" I just can't believe that even with a diet devoid of cholesterol you can have high cholesterol levels thanks to lack of exercise. I'd need some kind of proof backing that up." I can search up studies from pubmed, but for the ease of work will u accept article of healthline instead stating that dietary cholesterol has no link to blood cholesterol or heart diseases? https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/dietary-cholesterol-does-not-matter#bottom-line If not I can search from pubmed and give u, it's just too much work :V

B12 is naturally occurring in the soil, but factory farming doesn't feed cows grass anymore, so they have to be fortified with it. "But most factory-farmed animals are kept indoors and never even see soil during their lifetimes, so would certainly be deficient without supplementation. These horrible artificial conditions make the "vegan diet is unnatural" argument seem somewhat ironic. In fact, around 95% of all B12 supplements manufactured are actually given to farmed animals." https://www.riseofthevegan.com/blog/b12-is-not-just-a-vegan-problem Vegan food is also fortified like soy and rice milks with B12, a long with certain mock meats. Vegan B12 supplements are actually made of a type of fungi, which has B12 in it. So basically my point is meat has nothing you cant supplement for, B12 included.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29914176/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31838890/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19751443/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28359368/ These are some citations that show that dietary cholesterol has no link to blood cholesterol levels. Infact the 2015-2020 food guidelines have removed the upper limit of 300 mg of cholesterol that they had originally given to healthy food (like I thought, 5 years back)

I.... Suppose? I don't know enough about cholesterol I guess to continue on that point, so I guess I'll give it to you? Can we go back to the cholesterol levels you cited before in the study I posted? I'll bring up that those weren't vegans, those were vegetarians, and vegetarians eat eggs, and eggs ar insanely high in saturated fat and cholesterol, so I say that vegans would be lower cholesterol still in comparison. In the end though it doesn't matter because you are still at a higher risk if you eat meat, and eating meat does not give you any added health benefits that you can not supplement for. B12 is even supplemented for in meat itself, so you can not say you are taking it in naturally. You are taking in supplements.

Thankyou ^^ Ohh, I think there was that distinction, the vegans who ate eggs were called "ovo-vegetarian" or something and who did not were vegetarian? If anything, the ovo-vegetarians had the best health index compared to vegans or carnists in the studies we saw. I can agree on the supplementing part, if u can prepare vegan food rich in proteins and supplemented with micronutrients and other things, then it would become a well-balanced diet and the healthiest. But, why do that when u can eat omnivorous diet within the dietary levels instead and have the same results. Infact egg is considered the healthiest and wholest food available, so I see no need to switch to a supplemented vegan food, over egg.

It is late here, so I will continue the debate later :V I would agree that a supplemented vegan food is equivalent to a well balanced omnivorous food. but I don't really see how vegan food is superior to omnivorous food regarding health benefits. Though, I can agree that in some conditions, one food is better than other. If anything eggs are the undisputed contenders for the healthiest food, and if u dont want cholesterol, you can just have the egg white ^^ That's all~