Lishifu

. @vezax Same in India.. they arent given painkillers :/ I was kinda shocked when i saw deliveries during my postings... the women cry soo much and yet the resident-docs dont bother much in our gov. hospital. Well not giving pain-killers also have a medical reason as docs need to know the reaction of the woman during delivery, but sometimes its just too much.. Though i am pretty sure in Private hospitals pain killers are given more frequently!

Lishifu @hakutaku Yeah...Doctors and nurses here are indifferent to those women's crying as well, they are used to it..Most Chinese people didn't know painless labor until the news that a woman jumped out of windows due to the pain of laborl was reported. Here in China, c-section is widely adopted, still natural labor is preferred by many people especially the old who cannot accept anything new. They are worried that c-section will do harm to the baby. The same thing goes with painless labor, people are ignorant of it, so they dare not run the risk. Moreover, people tend to blame physical problems they have after childbirth on new ways of labor or "catching cold during the month of confinement"...How many days do women in your country need so as to recover after childbirth? Same. In Private hospitals, painkillers are provided and recommended.

. @vezax Well here c-section is not performed unless the situation demands it or there is any complications, since it involved quite an invasive procedure ^^ Thats sad that the woman had to suicide out of labor pain :/ I dont think physical problems have any relation to new ways of child birth, infact new way of birth were developed to solve many of the existing problems! Here it takes 4-6 weeks of rest for a woman to recover in theory, but i havent seen a woman post pregnancy for that long so i dont know, mostly the patients who come to government hospitals are very poor, so i dont think they take rest for even 1-2 weeks as they have soo much work pending in their house :( But yest, they do stay in the hospital for 2-3 days ^^

. @vezax *involves Omg this typo

. @vezax Disagreed

Lishifu @hakutaku Agree! For example, if Karl Marx were erased from history, ideologies like "Marxism" would still be established by someone else.But the outcomes may be different.So-called historical inevitability.

. @vezax If the outcomes are different then you cant say that the same history has come to pass. Moreover there are certain people who if removed from history, then it would either take a long time for the same ideas to come again or maybe those ideas and eventual actions wont ever come to pass again. Like the scientists who discovered things by accident (those accidents which have very less chance to occur) or scientists who discovered revolutionary ideas. Eg. Humankind have existed since thousands of years and yet it was only these recent few 100 years when vaccines where discovered and exteacted, sure after the first vaccine was discovered the later modifications came much faster and if those people were removed from history then they would be replaced. But the first discovery of vaccine which was accidental if removed from history the we would take a lot more time again for vaccines to come back. Same with the relativistic science and quantum mechanics, einstein's theory of relativity is super-alien theory.. not even modern scientists can understand it properly, i dont think if einstein was removed then another person can replace him and discover that, coz its discover was a mix of excessive imagination and accident. Or maybe just consider the bigbang, if that fortunate bigbang which created us didnt happen then it would take another soo long how much time to create us again as the chances are extreemely low. But yes given infinite time everything can happen again and again, but human-species dont have infinite time to live. Tbh, i completely removed chaos theory while speaking of all these, if we consider chaos theory into the equation then just removing any one of the insignificant common people from history will produce unpredictable unimaginable outcomes in the coming years thus preventing the previous history to take place ever.

. @vezax If the outcomes are different then you cant say that the same history has come to pass. Moreover there are certain people who if removed from history, then it would either take a long time for the same ideas to come again or maybe those ideas and eventual actions wont ever come to pass again. Like the scientists who discovered things by accident (those accidents which have very less chance to occur) or scientists who discovered revolutionary ideas. Eg. Humankind have existed since thousands of years and yet it was only these recent few 100 years when vaccines where discovered and exteacted, sure after the first vaccine was discovered the later modifications came much faster and if those people were removed from history then they would be replaced. But the first discovery of vaccine which was accidental if removed from history the we would take a lot more time again for vaccines to come back. Same with the relativistic science and quantum mechanics, einstein's theory of relativity is super-alien theory.. not even modern scientists can understand it properly, i dont think if einstein was removed then another person can replace him and discover that, coz its discover was a mix of excessive imagination and accident. Or maybe just consider the bigbang, if that fortunate bigbang which created us didnt happen then it would take another soo long how much time to create us again as the chances are extreemely low. But yes given infinite time everything can happen again and again, but human-species dont have infinite time to live. Tbh, i completely removed chaos theory while speaking of all these, if we consider chaos theory into the equation then just removing any one of the insignificant common people from history will produce unpredictable unimaginable outcomes in the coming years thus preventing the previous history to take place ever.